TOPIC:

I'm new on this website, so may be being dim about where I am placing this. I have both grandfathers who were in the 2nd Boer War (one 18th Hussars, and one RAMC), my great uncle (the VC) and I believe another great uncle who was, according to family legend "...killed at Nicholson's Nek". Will work my way around my other relatives, but where do I go to get onto casualty rolls to determine this -from what little I know, I don't think he was with the Gloucestershire Regt. in that debacle, but it may have been later. No idea what regiment he was in, but that should be able to be narrowed down with those that were besieged in Ladysmith...

Any ideas would be most appreciated!!

Can you please advise the full name or at least the initials..... I have checked the casualty list and there are a number of Lawrence's but none at Nicholson's Nek.....

Mike

...many thanks Mike. I did go through this exercise some 10-15 years back, and whoever assisted me then said, as you have said -there were no Lawrence casualties at Nicholson's Nek. Hence I feel the need to broaden the spectrum and therefore am in need of some ideas/leads. I looked at the list of casualties on the website here and nothing 'jumped out' at me... I also am in possession of a great big tome of 'Casualties of the S.A.F.F.' however that has only the fewest of references pre-March 1900. It also doesn't have Private Hayman 'injury' who was involved in my Great Uncle and his VC, but maybe a dislocated shoulder doesn't qualify for being 'slightly injured'. It is a wonderful book and whilst I am sure there will be some errors, it is quite a feat of compilation, however I do remain curious about the categories of 'woundedness' -slightly injured/wounded, wounded, severely wounded/injured, and dangerously wounded! I'm getting distracted...

The fellow was Harold Lawrence. His brothers, George Marcus Lawrence was 18th Hussars and Tom Lawrence VC of the 17th Lancers. With some degree of logic, it could be assumed that Harold would have gone for a cavalry regiment too. The family all stemmed from Bewdley in Worcestershire, and hence the possibilities in the Gloucestershire Regt.

The 18th Hussars obviously had quite a bit to do with that neck of the woods and that could be a possibility -brothers in the same unit? Could he have been among those 18th Hussars that were lost at Talana Hill? The 'family legend' stems from a small article in a Worcestershire newspaper when Tom won his VC, that his brother Marc and Harold were in SA too, Harold unfortunately being killed at Nicholson's Nek. Newspapers have a certain notoriety for getting things wrong!!!

Marc (my grandfather) was, I believe, with Dundonald. This stems from yet another newspaper clipping from a Kenyan newspaper referring to a Ladysmith Reunion Dinner held in Nairobi -probably back in the late 1940s, referring to Captain Marc Lawrence as "...the first man into Ladysmith reporting to General White two days before the main Relief Column arrived". During the Boer War, according to his Army Service Record he appears as a fairly ill disciplined trooper who could barely handle the responsibility of being a Lance Corporal! Oral history says he was doing a lot of scouting on horseback. So whilst it was eminently possible that he could have been the first man in if he was in that role. However I suspect that it is more of a newspaper misinterpretation, and what actually happened was that he arrived in Ladysmith as part of Dundonald's column two days ahead of Buller's column. I am sure there are countless claims of who was actually the first man into Ladysmith. However I have no 'definitive proof' as to where he was... so this could all be wrongly assumed!

Many thanks indeed,


Tom

Tom,

A quick, initial reply. There is a companion volume to the Casualties of the SAFF for the Natal Field Force.

It is in that volume that the casualties for Nicholson's Nek are listed. The names from that book are available on this site. Try searching by surname from the home page.

More anon
David

Tom

If your grandfather was indeed with the first group of men to enter Ladysmith, he would have been serving with the Composite Regiment (Major Gough) of the Mounted Brigade (Lord Dundonald). Although the Composite Regiment did include one company of Imperial Mounted Infantry (2nd King's Royal Rifle Corps), and possibly some men from a second Imperial regiment (Royal Dublin Fusiliers MI), there were only Colonials in that first group. They were men mainly from the Imperial Light Horse, Natal Carbineers and Natal Police, with a few from the Natal Mounted Rifles and, possibly, the Border Mounted Rifles.

The Natal Police was a permanent force, while the NC, NMR and BMR were Natal volunteer regiments similar to the Territorials in Britain today, so they were made up of men settled in the Colony of Natal. The ILH was an irregular regiment raised in anticipation of the Boer War and it is perhaps the one your grandfather is most likely to have joined if he was in South Africa at the time and looking to take part in the coming war.

Regards
Brett

Dear Mike, Brett and David,

...just to answer things off in one fell swoop.

Mike -have got all the Lawrences you guys have on the site and am working my way through them. by a process of elimination. There's a lot of us!!! I ahev a reasonable amount about both my grandfather and a lot about my Great Uncle Tom, which am very happy to give to the site to add to the database -is that 'wanted' or will a personal biography all all and sundry swamp it! Who is the right person to contact?

David -sadly I don't have a copy of the Natal Field Force Casualties... but will see if I can find one. It's not the easiest from Kenya, but should be in the UK in September and so through various book lots will see what I can come up with.

With regard the 'first man into Ladysmith' thing. Brett -many thanks for your clarification there, and good to have a slightly more in depth view on who the ILH were. If my grandfather joined the ILH he would have had to have transferred out of the 18th Hussars and that would have to be on his Army Service Record, which it's not... and in which case I think it is unlikely that he would have been with them. And in which case would it have been likely that a trooper from the 18th Hussars would have been with Major Gough?

Also looking in the Casualties of the S.A.F.F. 18th Hussars etc, all the 'rankers' in most regiments were referred to as Privates rather than Troopers -any particular reason for that? Or is it just bureaucracy -them's that compiled the book just referred to all 'rankers' as Privates and that's the way it was. There are a few regiments where they are referred to as troopers, but don't have it to hand!

Many thanks to you both,


Tom