Welcome, Guest
Username: Password: Remember me

TOPIC:

A lot of Questions! 8 years 2 months ago #45153

  • Lazyresearcher
  • Lazyresearcher's Avatar Topic Author
  • Offline
  • Fresh recruit
  • Fresh recruit
  • Posts: 6
  • Thank you received: 0
Hi
I am trying to find out, for the purposes of a novel that I am trying to write, whether the character I am creating stands up to scrutiny historically. My character has had a career in a cavalry company (not sure which one would be most appropriate) in the 1890's, seeing action in Afghanistan and Sudan, but then he comes back to England to company HQ and bored with his lot, training recruits etc, he hears about the South African Light Horse being formed in Cape Colony. He is in his early/mid twenties, and I want him to have joined the company as a groom.
1st Question : Is it feasible that he might have joined as a groom and if so, at what age would he have been allowed to enlist?
2nd Question : What is the minimum period that he could have enlisted for? 10 years?
3rd Question: If he wanted to leave the company how would he go about doing that?
4th Question: I have read somewhere that the SALH wanted English officers but would they have taken other ranks?
5th Question: I want him to join the SALH as a trooper but perhaps get promotion. Would he be considered too young to be a sergeant?
6th Question: If a trooper was accused of insubordination by an officer, what would be the result? I presume court martial, a spell in military prison and then dishonourable discharge?
I am sorry to ask so many questions but if anyone can answer ANY of them I would be most grateful. Thanks!

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

A lot of Questions! 8 years 2 months ago #45156

  • rdarby
  • rdarby's Avatar
  • Offline
  • Senior Member
  • Senior Member
  • Posts: 596
  • Thank you received: 119
Hi

I'm sure an expert on the unit will be along soon, but here are some replies in the meantime:

Why a groom? It may be a plot device, but the South African units were smaller and formed for the purposes of the war, and did not have too many servants following them around. You tended to look after your own horse.

Someone with that type of experience is probably going to join as a useful member of the Horse, not a groom. Probably with rank too, maybe a Sargent and then promotion?

Enlistments were typically 6 months for the purposes of the war.

Insubordination would probably get a fine, there was a war on and it would be a lot less likely to end up in prison as you would in a British unit back in England. If you want that type of tradition and pomp and ceremony, a Guards unit coming out to South Africa is more likely.

People went to South Africa for adventure and to not have all of the red tape!

Good luck
Ryan
The following user(s) said Thank You: Lazyresearcher

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

A lot of Questions! 8 years 2 months ago #45158

  • LinneyI
  • LinneyI's Avatar
  • Offline
  • Moderator
  • Moderator
  • Posts: 2708
  • Thank you received: 1537
Lazyresearcher
You seem to want to tick a lot of boxes for your projected hero's career. I don't know of any British Cavalry regiment that served in both Afghanistan and the Sudan in the 1890's ("odd men" attached could well have done so). However the 21st Lancers had a highly publicised role in the Sudan (W.S.Churchill rode with them). I suppose you could craft your tale by having your man enlist in the 17thL (occupation/trade; groom) as a start. Cavalry enlistment was amended in 1874 to eight years with the colours and four years in the reserve according to my references; so you can figure out the likely time scale as well as IL. Once he went to the Reserve, he would have to have left an address at which he could be recalled; admittedly if he went to the Cape to seek adventure after his eight years with the colours, he might be a bit hard to contact. Story mechanism there?
Enlistments in the SALH at the commencement of the ABW would have been for six months as Ryan says. You might note that a certain WSC also served in the SALH and some sort of continuity could be invented there. If an other rank was charged with insubordination on active service, as you seem to want to weave into your story, the sentence after a Field Court Martial could be severe. Depending on how bad the "insubordination" was and which grade of officer was offended. After all, there was a war on - AND there are no degrees of discipline; either one has it or one does not. One of the medal groups I currently own tells of an OR who "offered violence to an officer" and lost his Good Conduct pay as well as serving six months detention.
Regards
IL.
The following user(s) said Thank You: Lazyresearcher

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

A lot of Questions! 8 years 2 months ago #45159

  • Lazyresearcher
  • Lazyresearcher's Avatar Topic Author
  • Offline
  • Fresh recruit
  • Fresh recruit
  • Posts: 6
  • Thank you received: 0
Thanks Ryan
That's most helpful!
I wanted my character to be one of those farm boys who knew about horses, and was enamoured of one of old traditional cavalry companies as a boy, and so would want to join them as soon as he could. That's how I came up with the groom idea. But I suppose that his enlistment probably wouldn't have counted as time spent as a groom; would it?
So I wanted him to have had experience and seen action in one of the traditional outfits and only then to have gone to South Africa, exactly as you say, 'for adventure'.
I like your idea of him already having attained the rank of sergeant before he gets to Cape Colony; what would have been his next promotion?
Sorry to pose yet more questions!
But thanks very much indeed for all your input!

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

A lot of Questions! 8 years 2 months ago #45160

  • rdarby
  • rdarby's Avatar
  • Offline
  • Senior Member
  • Senior Member
  • Posts: 596
  • Thank you received: 119
There were many cases of men being say a Sgt or officer in the UK and dropping back to the ranks just to be able to get into the units in South Africa as there were not many slots for seniors. In some cases they were promoted the next day.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

A lot of Questions! 8 years 2 months ago #45161

  • Lazyresearcher
  • Lazyresearcher's Avatar Topic Author
  • Offline
  • Fresh recruit
  • Fresh recruit
  • Posts: 6
  • Thank you received: 0
Thanks for all your answers. The 21st Lancers seems like an excellent suggestion, I have actually got Churchill's account of Omdurman in his 'War Correspondence 1895 -1900' So yes, it would seem like a good idea to link my character roughly to Churchill's experiences both in Sudan and the Cape.

I could perhaps do away with the the idea of his being a groom and instead just have him join the Lancers at the earliest opportunity. Would you happen to know the minimum age that a man could be enlisted into the cavalry in the 1890's?

I could perhaps have him ignore his obligation to the reserve in order to get him to the Cape.

The case you cite of an OR 'offering violence to an officer' is very useful indeed. In my fiction I imagine that my character as an OR with some 'personal history' with a man who is the same age as him but a Captain.

The situation in which I want to place my character is one where the SALH are asked to take a hill, knowing that they have re-enforcements coming some way behind, The Boers are at the top of the hill, but their artillery is further down and shelling the troop (who have dismounted) from an angle. I imagine a situation in which the CO is a Major who is picked off by a sniper, and the second in command is a Captain who bears my character a grudge, and whom non of the men respect, because of his lack of judgment etc. So when he is called upon to take command, the Captain gives orders for an assault just when the Boer artillery have found their range. Several men are immediately killed by shellfire including the Captain's best friend. He goes to pieces slightly, and my character ( a sergeant) takes it upon himself to get the officer to take proper command, and then when this doesn't work, he takes it on himself, and leads a successful assault on the hill just as the artillery re-enforcements start get a bead on the Boer artillery. The outcome being that the officer decides to save his face by accusing my character of insubordination.
I'm sure you'll all be having a good laugh at the unlikeliness of this situation but hell, it's fiction!
Tell me what you really think of this - is it in any way believable?
Thanks for your help!

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Moderators: djb
Time to create page: 1.039 seconds
Powered by Kunena Forum